RxISK

Making Medicines Safer for All of Us

Dennis the Menace gets Covid

30 Comments

Last March when the world was locking down for the first time in response to Covid, Joan-Ramon Laporte primarily, with me tagging along, wrote a short piece on polypharmacy as a possible hazard for older people, especially those in residential or care homes.

Everybody was looking for the drug that might provide a miracle cure or get out of jail free card for people with Covid infections.

But if drugs can help, they can also harm.  What about the drugs you might be on that could make the problem worse and lead to a death that might not otherwise have happened?

Everybody hears about the crucifix or medal that saved the life of a person shot in the chest – because the survivor tells everyone and the media covers it.  We don’t hear from those who die from a bullet diverted from a crucifix or medal.

The article didn’t blame any drug,  It listed some reasons why some drug groups could pose problems and called for research to monitor the outcomes in people, especially older people in residential or care homes, some of whom are generally viewed as being on more drugs than is necessary.

The piece was sent to the BMJ, the Lancet, NEJM and other journals.  Universally it was returned to us without review.  Just turned down flat on the spot.

Given that all these journals and our newspapers and media outlets were stuffed full of Covid material, this was odd.

Just like patients with conditions other than Covid can’t get treated these days and die as a result, it seems articles on other topics don’t get published.  But in this case we were on the Covid money.

I tweeted that at a time when you could stick the word Covid on a Dennis the Menace cartoon and be published, it was remarkable that the journals would not take this ‘Modest Proposal’ as Jonathan Swift might have called it.

We finally opted to publish on RxISK

Medications Compromising Covid Infections

It was well received and led Frank Barat to interview Joan-Ramon

Covid and the Market in Research

Frank also interviewed me – an interview I’m pleased with maybe too pleased.

Your medications may post more of a risk than your Covid.

Anyone Out There?

Some people were interested.

A group in Sweden got in touch shortly afterwards to say that they had posted data and a position paper on a Swedish Government website supporting what we had said – finding there was in fact a risk from some of the drugs that older people are on.

The document in Swedish is HERE.

The translation is HERE.

After that Paul McKeigue, an epidemiologist from Edinburgh made contact and said he and colleagues had found something similar.

The McKeigue paper has just been published in BMC Medicine.  It supports the key points being made nearly a year ago.

Mentioning the McKeigue paper on RxISK is not going to make much of a difference.  Its a bit like heading out on a paddle-board toward an incoming Tidal Wave.  It’ll be worth it if anyone spots either Joan-Ramon or me waving from the top of the Tidal Wave – and perhaps wonders what kind of idiot would head out on a paddle board in conditions like this.

Maybe Dennis should have asked –

Is it better to stay Young and never know Better?

Covid is an instance of Disaster Medicine – a chance to get more people on more stuff whether drugs or vaccines.  Not a time to choose wisely.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Filed Under: Covid

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Comments

  1. It is now out patriotic duty to have a vaccine – the Queen of great Britain and bits of the rest of the world says so. Am i the only one to wonder if her husband who has been admitted to hospital after they both had been vaccinated ,is suffering any adverse effects to the vaccine he was given a week or so ago? Shame she and the rest of the family didn’t speak out when it became public knowledge that thousands of people around her own age had been allowed to die in ‘care homes’ – isn’t it dreadful…….
    If so the answer will be in a locked box not to be oopened for 100 years. Those of us who decline the vaccines are being browbeaten more and more into taking them with not so covert threats of becoming second class citizens without ‘passports’ The vaccine tzar was adamant that vaccine passports wouldn’t happen – in UK the cradle of democracy! surely not. So seems They are to be called certificates instead. It matters when as happened in the Aids crisis ,infected people were being terrified with threats of segregation , even to being sent to live on islolated islands – this is happening in Israel where eg anyone without a passport can only holiday on a segregated island.

    This is more helpful than any message from the queen
    Re: Covid-19: Vaccine success drives England’s lockdown exit Gareth Iacobucci, Elisabeth Mahase. 372:doi 10.1136/bmj.n528
    Dear Editor
    If you look at the MHRA website for the current lists of adverse reactions for both the Pfizer-Biontech and Astra Zeneca vaccines, you will see a steady increase since roll out. Both vaccines now have over 20,000 reported adverse reactions. Many are very serious, complete deafness after one vaccination, several cardiac related issues, dermatological problems, neurological issues, narcolepsy cases. None of these vaccines have been granted full regulatory approval (Market authorisation). The adverse reaction build up is a regulatory ticking time bomb. I have asked MHRA what happens when the 1 year temporary approval expires in 2021 and what happens if these adverse reactions continue to mushroom.

    I would argue it is not simply these novel temporary approved vaccines which is reducing admissions (the trials were not designed to demonstrate this), the UK high mortality of 100,000+ has effectively wiped out a large proportion of the most vulnerable in the population, hence fewer of these are being admitted. Moreover diagnosis & treatment for patients presenting with Covid-19 symptoms has greatly improved since last year with improved patient recovery, this is more significant than giving the population a single jab of the Astra Zeneca vaccine, whose efficacy & effectiveness for the 65+s have already been disputed by the European Medicines Agency and other EU health agencies.

    However readmissions have steadily increased for those who have recovered from Covid-19 and then subsequently developed “Long Covid” or had their underlying conditions exacerbated. ICUs are full of long Covid cases and those with worsened underlying conditions.

    Ireland has not followed UK policy and instead of giving everyone a single jab, is administering the vaccines in two jabs within the recommended intervals not 12 weeks, which is contrary to manufacturer’s user instructions and trial conditions under which temporary regulatory approval was granted.

    Competing interests: No competing interests

    Reply

    • I came off Seroxat nine years ago had symptoms ever since haven’t taken any drugs since stopping haven’t been on here for a bit I was looking for info. Haven’t had a COVID jab yet I’m 43 but I know I won’t be long before I probably get a letter in the post. Problem is I had an adverse reaction coming off seroxat (was part off uk litigation which is now over how they got away with it unbelievable) and my nervous system has never been right feel like I never fully recovered etc so I worry how it would effect me having this COVID jab etc. My body is still sensitive to foods alcohol lots of different things post seroxat and I still get zaps etc nine years off bad ones with periods off no zaps. Developed fibro as well which I’m sure was caused by stress off withdrawal still don’t take any drugs for this so my question is if anyone knows if these jabs could adversely effect someone who has been damaged by ssris would appreciate any answers. Basically I know it’s a hard question but if you have been in a similar situation to me like a lot off you have I wondered if any off you have had the jab and feel alright etc. appreciate anyone’s input personally thinking about not having it cheers Karl 👍

      Reply

      • This is a great and really important question. Has anyone with protracted withdrawal had the jab and if so what has happened? Would be great if anyone reading this could email anyone they know with protracted withdrawal who might have had a jab – although chances are they are too low down the priority list still – to see what has happened

        David Healy

        Reply

        • I have asked several contacts with protracted withdrawal or other post SSRI issues and the most interesting comment perhaps was that lots of people with these states get flu shots without a problem – why would it be different. Its looks like there is one person so far with a bad response but there are a lot of bad responses in people who have never had an SSRI so this may not mean there is a link.

          A lot comes down to your attitude to Covid. If you think its terrible or belong to an at risk group, this might have you looking at it one way and there are likely lots of people on or previously on SSRIs who will have this point of view. There are others who likely think its not that bad or unlikely to harm me who might be more wary.

          A lot comes down to trust in institutions and for many who have been damaged by drugs – see the Discarded by GSK post this week – this trust will not readily be regained.

          David

          Reply

          • I can totally relate to what you said about trust issues for medical help post ssri use I for one have had it to the extent I don’t take any tablets anymore and question everything and don’t trust doctors totaly anymore this is obviously a result after being harmed by people I trusted as a young person all those years ago I suppose it’s a form off ptsd when you think about it.
            Dont know whether I’ll be having the jab anyway because off this think I may have had COVID back in May went to A and E three times where they didn’t test me for it once only gave me an X-ray and ecg was having trouble breathing and it still isn’t right now had aches and pains at the time lost a stone and a half put it back on now felt awful because I have fibro hard to tell the difference with the physical pains at the time. Breathing still isn’t right never had any problems with it before feel winded constantly to a mild degree my partners sister had it so maybe I caught it off her When we visited briefly who knows was thinking about doing a antibody test but how reliable would that be 8 months after first having symptoms ?

          • I think antibody tests 8 months later not worth much – googling might give you an answer.

            I think trust is the key issue. Trust in the institutions. Lots of people who do not have protracted withdrawal problems https://davidhealy.org/shifting-vaccine-confidence/ – like me. Difficult to trust a system that delivers almost nothing but Fake News about drugs and vaccines etc. Doesn’t mean the vaccines don’t work. Or will cause problems to someone with a protracted withdrawal syndrome.

            Some people damaged by SSRIs will enthusiastically embrace vaccines. Others perhaps like you will be wary. Some more like me will have a view that is more one of – if I can’t go to visit my family without a vaccine that might give me the incentive to have one when otherwise I could do without. I don’t feel the fear that would drive me there – but I’m older than you. I’d never have had one if I was 99 like Philip. Whether you are enthusiastic, very worried as many quite reasonably are, or more middle of the road like me – whatever the risks are they are independent of how we feel but how we feel has been shaped by companies like Pfizer and from the inside it seems to me they show absolutely no concern for any of us – other than as profit points

            David

          • Thankyou for your time David if you hear anything else down the line about post ssri Users in protracted withdrawal having adverse reactions which I hope isn’t the case please could you keep us posted on RiskI will check out the Discarded by GSk post tomorow evening because I’m going to bed lol. I will definately be relating to that story they left me maimed and many others and got away with it. Night mate 👍

          • Hi David been nearly three months since I posted on here and spoke to you asking you if you had heard off any people with protracted withdrawal having any bad reactions to the COVID vaccines basically people with long term legacy persistent effects after ssri discontinuation like I and many others have suffered for years post seroxat/ssris
            Last time you said there didn’t seem to be to much concern and people with protracted withdrawal seemed to be effected much the same way as the general population does that seem to be the same now I just wondered if you had heard anything different now the vaccines have been adminstered to more people ? Any feedback would be appreciated Thankyou Karl 😊

          • Karl

            No updates but seems like someone could make a fortune spreading a story about interactions between SSRI withdrawal and Pfizer’s vaccine to judge by today’s news

            D

            David

        • Thankyou David It would be good to know someone’s experience who has had the vaccine and is still in protracted withdrawal has long term effects etc. I am one off these people nearly nine years drug free so obviously I am apprehensive about having it especially after how sensitive I am to most thinks post Seroxat. Maybe this will be covered more down the line Havent been on here for a while see your still fighting our corner you and Bob Fiddaman and several others are hero’s as far as I’m concerned keep up the good work top man 👍

          Reply

        • Hi David just thought Id ask wondered if you had heard any bad outcomes with people in protracted withdrawal who had had the vaccines it’s been a while since I spoke to you last time and asked u wondered if you’d heard anything I’ve been offered the phizer but sceptical because off my continued discontinuation symptoms nine years post seroxat any news would be appreciated thankyou 🙂

          Reply

          • Karl

            No updates to offer – sorry – wish we knew more one way or the other

            David

  2. No one with any sense will take any notice of what the royal family say considering the difference in healthcare they get and the general public. It’s just a media stunt to get people to comply with vaccines and most people know that.

    The news is now reporting relatives are complaining their deceased relatives have Covid recorded on their death certs when it wasn’t what they died from. Families are calling for a public inquiry. (Was in the daily mail today).

    No flu deaths this year recorded apparently either.

    We are living in very strange times.

    Reply

    • Do you remember, back in March last year, when Covid deaths were spoken about, we’d sometimes hear that a person had died “of Covid”, others would be said to have died ” with Covid”. I took that to mean that in the first instance, Covid had been the main cause of death and that ‘with Covid’ meant that this was not the main cause. Whether my way of thinking was correct or not I’ve no idea but, either way, we don’t seem to hear that difference any more – they are simply “Covid deaths”. Maybe someone noticed a pattern in the “with Covid” deaths – which could have been avoided if J-R L and DH’s words had been heeded – and decided it was safer to stop using the distinction and just lump them all as one group!

      Reply

      • Smart Sarah Vine, wife of Cabinet Minister Michael Gove, echoes Mary’s thoughts…

        https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-9308251/SARAH-VINE-Nick-Clegg-vice-president-global-affairs-Facebook-Prince-Harry-politics.html

        Dear Captain Tom was finally laid to rest yesterday, having lifted all our lives.
        But it saddens me that he is constantly described as yet another ‘victim’ of Covid. 
        He may have tested positive for the disease at his time of passing, but his cause of death was really pneumonia as a result of extreme old age. 
        And increasingly it seems there may be many others in a similar situation, people who have died with Covid but not necessarily of Covid. 
        Isn’t it time this distinction was reflected in the statistics?

        Sarah has had notable personal publicity about Antidepressant Withdrawal, and Effects ….

        Sarah, an exemplary journalist, who follows Mary 🙂

        Reply

        • Annie – I generally agree with every comment you make but I think your last remark this time is way off the mark! I think this is a rare moment when Sarah Vine gets my full agreement!

          Reply

          • Duly admonished, Mary.
            Sorry my feeble attempt at humour landed the way it did.
            I seem to have made a rather cack-handed job of expressing my compliment to you, so sorry for the rankle, Mary, especially when the core-problem of Covid data is so mired in duplicity which you brought out so clearly ‘backed up’ by Sarah Vine whose husband seems to have a rather different agenda …

    • Anne-Marie One of the campaigns is Campaign for the Care of the Vulnerable. I’ve sent them info before with no response – am trying again by sending them the two studies David has flagged up plus his and Joan Le Raport’s blog of a year ago. Strange and rather scary times for sure

      Reply

  3. Mary I haven’t noticed that but with so much spin it;s a job to keep up. J V D as Matt H likes to cosily refer to Mr trustworthy said we can look forward to a better situation in Autumn – another of the 3 wise men has said things will open up in June. ….
    RE the Post though there is more on the news doen here about children getting covid, What will hppen to Dennis?

    from the post
    ‘After that Paul McKeigue, an epidemiologist from Edinburgh made contact and said he and colleagues had found something similar.

    The McKeigue paper has just been published in BMC Medicine. It supports the key points being made nearly a year ago.

    Mentioning the McKeigue paper on RxISK is not going to make much of a difference.’

    David – It did make a difference though ? Or do you mean the contribution to the studies in Sweden and Scotland won’t lead to any change in practice?

    But anyway will send the study to F Hussein who wrote of her sterling efforts to get everyone vaccinated in the East End of London – the deprived bit not the trendy bit . Close the door, take the phone off the hook if you dont want to ‘explain why’ and have made a considered decision not to be vaccinated.
    ‘Your ‘ GP is watching you…. .nobody has to explain themselved to anyone unless they wish to – but how many will be too scared not to take the call…and feel too scared not to accept after a ‘personal call’ identifying them individually

    as https://managementinpractice.com/news/gp-personally-calling-every-vulnerable-patient-who-has-yet-to-take-up-offer-of-covid-vaccine/
    not having had a vaccination..
    GP ‘personally calling’ every vulnerable patient who has yet to take up offer of Covid vaccine
    by James Hacker
    24 February 2021
    A GP is improving uptake of the Covid vaccine in her community by personally phoning every eligible patient who has yet to take up the offer of a vaccination.

    Dr Farzana Hussain, a GP partner at the Project Surgery, East London, began calling patients last week to provide ‘reassurance and reliable advice’ to members of communities with lower vaccination rates.

    She said: ‘I’m phoning everyone at my practice who is eligible but yet to get the vaccine to talk to them about why and have already reached more than 50 people aged 65 and older so far, with many of them now looking to take up the invite.’ (How many? out of the just 50 F H must know )

    The uptake in Dr Hussain’s Newham practice is lower than the national average of 90%, which she said is linked in partto the community’s ethnically diverse population. (loosing out on payment there – approx £24 per person plus fee for phoning = need to do better one practice has joined up to become a federation with 36000 people on it;s books-hooks))
    Dr Hussain said that ‘in the vast majority of cases there is a hesitancy rather than outright rejection’ of the vaccine. (how many? theyv’e done the maths)

    According to Dr Hussain, one piece of misinformation spreading in her local communities, which also has a particular impact on women, is around fertility.

    ‘This disinformation comes from a real sense of shame that not being able to bear children brings and is a particular issue among women from African and Asian backgrounds,’ she said.

    ‘They would refuse the vaccine if there was a 1% chance of that happening, but I want to reassure people that there is no evidence of this at all.’ (Is it correct that no trials have been done to prove that? – who want to be the guinea pigs ladies?)

    Dr Hussain has also encountered patients whose uncertainty was based on religious grounds, including those who were uncertain as to whether a vaccine would break fasting during Ramadan, which is expected to begin on 12 April.

    Dr Hussain, who is a practising Muslim, said: ‘Getting an injection does not break the fast – it’s not nutrition. There is absolutely no reason why you shouldn’t have it.’ (Doctor knows best ) She could wait until after the fast for those who want it – speedy results are the essence)

    She added that the Koran ‘says saving your life is the most important thing, to save one life is to save the whole of humanity. It’s a responsibility of a practising Muslim to take their vaccine’. (Could she have given a reference for that)

    Other concerns patients shared with Dr Hussain included the belief that animal products were used in the vaccine, and the speed with which it was developed.

    ‘But more than 13 million people in England have had it now, and it’s great to be able to say that with proof there are no issues,’ she said. (Proof of No issues ! lies won’t engender trust if any of those in the Muslim community check it out- and dare to publish it see adverse effects on MHRA site -see above)

    A Royal Society of Public Health (RSPH) study, published December, found 57% of BAME respondents were ‘likely to accept’ a Covid-19 vaccine if advised to by a health professional, compared with 79% of those from white backgrounds. (BAME includes people from all sorts of diverse ethnic backgrounds – yet all are grouped together Maybe this health professional is not the right one when she is being a bit shady with the truth. Black or white

    Meanwhile, a study led by OpenSafely found that 86% of white people aged 70 to 79 were vaccinated by 11 February, compared with only 55% among black people of the same age, and 73% among people from South Asian backgrounds. ( – which ‘white people’ – East European, mixed parentage, Blond blue eyed or light brown in the same family – F H might have mentioned the lack of trust by communities who have been left on the scrap heap but are now needed to increase ‘herd immunity’
    The Swedish Study makes no specific mention of BAME nor i think ,did DH and J R-L in their previous warning about risks of medications and Covid . Maybe F H will do her professional duty to update her knowledge and read the study which I am going to send, even if they don’t,predictably, respond maybe some might be saved from a horrible illness or death.
    PS Just to add a note to avoid confusion – I have been using anon recently instead of my name for personal reasons but plus have a few days ago been scammed several times by someone(s) who say they are from ‘risk ‘- they slipped up by leaving out the x in Rxisk but use the same style as the blog. Didn’t think – Another person posts as anon so I will use to Annon from now on.

    Reply

  4. …………A review published on 2 April 2020 listed 17 widely pre-scribed drug classes associated with increased pneumoniarisk and therefore of concern as “medications compro-mising COVID” [2]. Excluding immunosuppressive drugsthat are criteria for shielding, (REACT-SCOT), we reported a strong association of severeCOVID-19 with dispensing of at least one prescription inthe past year [3]. . The objective of this study was to investigatewhat drug classes underlie this association and whetherany causal effects underlie these associations of severeCOVID-19 with dispensing of prescribed drugs.MethodsThedesignoftheREACT-. Record linkage studies using NHS data in Scotlandare governed by the Public Benefit and Privacy Panelfor Health and Social Care which includes patient andpublic representatives. s For thisanalysis based on ascertainment of positive test results upto 6 June 2020, entry to critical care up to 14 June 2020and deaths up to 12 June 2020, prescriptionsdispensed in a 240-day interval before this cutoff date………

    David – Could you explain what happens next after research is published or even before it’s published as it takes a while to get published. Is there some kind of alert? .
    Does it go to a next stage up the chain?The Edinburgh study mentions dates which proves it was known drugs were related to Covid deaths very early in the pandemic. Including by this groupPublic Benefit and Privacy Panelfor Health and Social Care which includes patient andpublic representatives, Why have they not made any noise?

    Also the Swedish Study was published in April last year. Lockdowns had already begun with huge numbers of deaths across Europe. Who would have been alerted in the different countries?
    The Swedish Study also mentions studies had been carried out in Italy……’Thisfinding (about a specific condition)is also in line with the results of the said Italian study, ….’
    Mostly what we were hearing about early on was pneumonia as far as remember . Wouldn’t all the information you have detailed as well have been known to Chris Whitty and all the other many experts who have given public anouncements for the past year?
    It has seemed to some that I have some bee in the bonnet about peoples’ need to read their medical notes. Hopefully those who have been kucking up won’t be denied access- if the haven’t been trashed already.

    Reply

    • When research gets done it goes nowhere. If it doesn’t suit powerful interests it doesn’t get published other than in journals where you have to pay a hefty fee. If it does get published, the most effective response if its not wanted is to just let it sit there – as for instance the most effective response to recent MAiD posts here from those who don’t like the issues being raised it not to comment. Debate, comment etc, spreads the virus.

      If research gets done by a powerful interest group it ends up in distribution channel – it features in places from Instagram to doctors email inboxes so that it comes to the attention of those who need to become aware of it and who will action it.

      The was described in a Healy article – downloadable from davidhealy.org or through the Shipwreck site on Samizdat – The psychopharmacological era: notes on a history. This is an example of what can be called The Luke Effect – seed sprinkled on rock dies, seed sprinkled where there are weeds gets choked, but seed that is sprinkled on fertile ground flourishes.

      David

      Reply

  5.  “We are getting very close to thought crime here, aren’t we?”

    Tory MP who spoke of ‘manipulated’ Covid figures may face action

    Swayne has claimed that criticism of him over the matter – and of another interview he gave to Del Bigtree, an anti-vaxxer and producer on Vaxxed, a 2016 film directed by the disgraced former physician Andrew Wakefield – was “disinformation that they’re spreading by lumping us all together when people have certainly legitimate points of view in a free society”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/30/tory-mp-who-said-covid-figures-were-manipulated-could-be-disciplined

    Gove told reporters: “Watch this space.”

    How Covid deaths are recorded.

    Peter Hitchens takes it on :

    ‘Here are some extracts, though I urge you to read it all:’

    I myself remain amazed that this subject has not attracted more attention. Dr John Lee, a distinguished pathologist, wrote in ‘The Spectator’ of 30th May 2020 that ‘In a country that has always prided itself on the quality of its facts and figures, the missing Covid-19 data is a national scandal.’

    https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2021/02/how-covid-deaths-are-recorded-.html

    Dr Lee added: ‘So at a time when accurate death statistics are more important than ever, the rules have been changed in ways that make them less reliable than ever. In what proportion of Covid-19 ‘mentions’ was the disease actually present? And in how many cases, if actually present, was Covid-19 responsible for death? Despite what you may have understood from the daily briefings, the shocking truth is that we just don’t know.

    How many of the excess deaths during the epidemic are due to Covid-19, and how many are due to our societal responses of healthcare reorganisation, lockdown and social distancing? Again, we don’t know. Despite claims that they’re all due to Covid-19, there’s strong evidence that many, perhaps even a majority, are the result of our responses rather than the disease itself.

    Reply

  6. I think this App may be of interest to people who desire an easier way to track their symptoms and record if any of the treatments, supplements and vitamins they take — help at all. It will also produce a PDF to show one’s doctor (to save committing everything to memory). As different people respond differently to treatments etc. the app’s developer hopes that as the data base of actual empirical evidence builds up from other people with the same conditions, it will be of use for guiding a more individualized treatment, rather than as in the current situation where a treating physician only has trial data to go on. And we all know about the slewed limitations of pharma trials. I see no reason that this app can’t be eventually extended to include guidance for when orthodox treatments go very wrong, leading to chronic dependence and ill health.
    I’ve found a video of the app’s developer being interviewed by an athlete struck down by long covid so it is covid biased but he also explains the general potential of the app as he see it, quite well I think.
    Can Tech Make You Better? | The PeopleWith App Just Might
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhCynNqm-oQ
    PeopleWith Website: https://www.peoplewith.com/

    Reply

  7. I had a very quick response from Paul M re the Sottish study – nothing from the Swedish researchers.
    Will add here if I get anything from the list below
    ———- Forwarded message ———
    From: Paul McKeigue
    Date: Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 12:23 PM
    Subject: Re: /2021/02/McKeigue-et-al-Covid.pd

    Dear (Annon)

    My co-author Bruce Guthrie works on initiatives to control over-prescribing in Scottish primary care

    I’ve sent the paper to

    1. the Scottish Patient Safety Programme’s Medicines Collaborative (under Health Care Improvement Scotland, now branded as the “ihub”)

    2. the Effective Prescribing and Therapeutics Branch, which is part of NHS Scotland but has email addresses in the gov.scot domain.
    3. Sarah Branch, head of VRMM (pharmacovigilance) at the (UK) Committee on Human Medicines
    Paul McKeigue
    Usher Institute
    College of Medicine and Veterinary Medicine
    University of Edinburgh
    Teviot Place, Edinburgh EH8 9AG
    Tel: +44 131 650 4556
    homepage: http://www.homepages.ed.ac.uk/pmckeigu/
    On 01/03/2021 11:44, Susanne Stevens wrote:
    This email was sent to you by someone outside the University.
    You should only click on links or attachments if you are certain that the email is genuine and the content is safe.

    Dear Paul Mckeigue
    David Healy as pointed us to your paper which includes reference to work he published last year.
    Could you let me know what the next stage will be with regard to taking action on the results?
    Thank you very much indeed
    best regards

    The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. Is e buidheann carthannais a th’ ann an Oilthigh Dhùn Èideann, clàraichte an Alba, àireamh clàraidh SC005336.

    Reply

  8. Comment from Anon

    There’s an article in the Lancet which highlights even more issues for people with mental health problems.

    Mentions clozapine specifically (amongs other warnings)
    PERSONAL VIEW|
    COVID-19 vaccination for people with severe mental illness: why, what, and how?
    Victor Mazereel, MD
    Prof Kristof Van Assche, PhD
    Johan Detraux, MD
    Prof Marc De Hert, MD
    Published:February 03, 2021DOI:https://doi.org/10.1016/S2215-0366(20)30564-2

    What are the potential interactions between vaccines and psychotropic medications?

    Not much is known about the effects of psychotropic medication on vaccination response. Antipsychotics might have a differential effect on several cytokines in people with psychosis, producing an anti-inflammatory effect in some individuals.76, 77, 78 An anti-inflammatory effect, however, might not always be desirable when considering vaccine efficacy because it might suppress the formation of antibodies.

    CLOZAPINE is associated with neutropenia, which can confer susceptibility to infection. A secondary antibody deficiency has been observed in patients with long-term clozapine use, putting these patients at risk of immunodeficiency.79 In a retrospective cohort study, clozapine was a possible risk factor for SARS-CoV-2 infection.80 Although a small study showed that influenza vaccination had no effect on clozapine serum concentrations,81 vaccination might affect clozapine concentrations through its action on cytochrome P450 metabolism.82 As of Dec 18, 2020, no pharmacodynamic data are available for the COVID-19 vaccines currently in testing to ascertain whether they influence cytochrome P450 metabolism and clozapine metabolism.
    Lithium has been proposed as an immunomodulatory adjuvant to increase the efficacy of viral vaccines in humans83, 84 because it exhibits some pro-inflammatory properties.85 However, as lithium has also shown some anti-inflammatory properties in healthy participants and patients,86, 87 its effects remain unclear and could be dose dependent. Other mood-stabilising agents, such as valproic acid, carbamazepine, and lamotrigine, also show a differential effect on several cytokines in healthy participants.86
    A meta-analysis showed that antidepressant treatment for people with major depression reduced the concentrations of several pro-inflammatory cytokines, resulting in an anti-inflammatory effect.88 Treatment with antidepressants normalised vaccination response to the varicella zoster vaccine in older patients (>60 years) with major depression. Although most psychopharmacological agents seem to affect several immunological markers and some of these agents interact with the proteins to which SARS-CoV-2 binds, how psychotropic drugs affect vaccination response and efficacy remains to be seen. Research is urgently needed to provide people with severe mental illness with adequate information on potential interactions between psychotropic medications and COVID-19 vaccines.

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  9. Although most psychopharmacological agents seem to affect several immunological markers and some of these agents interact with the proteins to which SARS-CoV-2 binds, how psychotropic drugs affect vaccination response and efficacy remains to be seen. ~ This is not good enough! Why take the risk? This is a real worry!
    If some people are immunosuppressed or have other major health issues and there is NO clinical data or enough research or evidence to evaluate how it impacts certain unhealthy individuals, why on earth is everyone who is ‘pro-Covid-19 vaccines’, insistent?
    I would err on the side of caution especially if this is uncharted territory!

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  10. A year on. Enough data from the phase III trials is now accumulating to show ‘on the balance of probabilities’ that the cure being promoted is worse that the disease.
    ~ hear! hear!

    “We are supportive in principle of the use of new medical interventions.” However, “there are serious concerns, including but not confined to those outlined above, that the approval of the COVID-19 vaccines by the EMA was premature and reckless, and that the administration of the vaccines constituted and still does constitute ‘human experimentation’, which was and still is in violation of the Nuremberg Code… we demand that approval for use of the gene-based vaccines be withdrawn until all the above issues have been properly addressed by the exercise of due diligence by the EMA.”
    ~ hear! hear!

    It is not only the way they are dealing with the Covid-19 vaccine!
    It is all other facets of medicines that concerns me!
    CORRUPTION at it’s BEST!

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